File contents

20:02 < schultmc> *GAVEL*
20:02 < schultmc> [item 1, opening] Today's Software in the Public Interest meeting is called to order.  Today's agenda and any pending resolutions are listed at http://www.spi-inc.org/secretary/agenda/2007/2007-03-16.html
20:02 < schultmc> [item 2, roll call] Board members, please state your name for the record.  As we have nine board members, quorum for today's meeting is six.  I note for the record that regrets have been received from David Graham.
20:02 < schultmc> Guests, please /msg your names to Maulkin for the record
20:02 < Hydroxide> Jimmy Kaplowitz
20:02 < jberkus> Josh Berkus
20:02 < schultmc> Michael Schultheiss
20:02 < IanJackson> Ian Jackson
20:02  * Maulkin waits
20:02 < Hydroxide> Maulkin: what about yourself? :)
20:02 < Maulkin> Neil McGovernm
20:02 < Maulkin> -m
20:03 < Maulkin> IanJackson: messageid?
20:03 < jberkus> hmm
20:03 < cdlu> David Graham
20:03 < IanJackson> <20070316194841.GI29336@mail.kaplowitz.org>
20:03  * cdlu makes us quorate. woot!
20:03 < Maulkin> Quorum
20:03 < schultmc> that's 6 board members - we're quorate
20:03  * cdlu just got home. good timing. :)
20:03 < schultmc> [item 3, president's report]
20:03  * schultmc isn't aware of anything from Bdale to report
20:03 < schultmc> [item 4, treasurer's report]
20:03 < schultmc> jberkus: you have the floor
20:04 < Hydroxide> jberkus: ping
20:04 < IanJackson> I'd like to thank jberkus for the report and ask him to keep up the good work.  Josh, do you need anything from us at the moment ?
20:04 < jberkus> howdy
20:04 < Hydroxide> I do have one thing to mention
20:04 < Hydroxide> regarding the treasurer's report
20:05 < jberkus> nope.  There has been no arguments about my proposed actions and expenditures, so I'm planning to go ahead with them.
20:05 < IanJackson> jberkus: Right, good.
20:05 < Maulkin> jberkus: I agree.
20:05 < Hydroxide> I believe we have $20 from when Gnome was an SPI project somewhere in there, as well as a small amount (probably $60-$150) of money for GNU TeXmacs
20:05 < Maulkin> They seem reasonable
20:05 < jberkus> the one other thing to mention is that Michael has been doing a stellar job as Asst. Treas.
20:05 < jberkus> and I expect to nominate him to run for my successor
20:05 < IanJackson> Hydroxide: I remember something like that too.  Perhaps we should take it offline and try to dig out some details ?
20:06 < Hydroxide> IanJackson: ok.
20:06 < Hydroxide> other than that I like the report
20:06 < jberkus> Hydroxide: please find some evidence for Gnome asap
20:06 < Hydroxide> jberkus: how about all my treasurer's reports? :)
20:06 < jberkus> I actually have the Texmacs money in my records, but afaik it was spent
20:06 < IanJackson> Hydroxide: Any idea how long ago the original money was ?
20:06 < jberkus> Hydroxide: I can't find any reference to gnome money
20:06 < Hydroxide> IanJackson: before my time as treasurer, possibly before branden's but I'm not sure
20:06 < jberkus> if it's there I missed it
20:07 < Hydroxide> jberkus: it's there. take a look, e.g., at the Apr 2006 report I made
20:07 < Maulkin> Can this be done offline? :)
20:07 < schultmc> yes, please
20:07 < Hydroxide> jberkus: under the Assets portion of the balance sheet, entitled "Known GNOME Earmark"
20:07 < Hydroxide> ok, let's move on
20:07 < schultmc> we're under time constraints
20:07 < schultmc> [item 5, secretary's report]
20:07 < schultmc> Maulkin: you have the floor
20:07 < Hydroxide> wait, do we want to vote to approve the treasurer's report?
20:08 < jberkus> Hydroxide: please e-mail me more detail
20:08 < Maulkin> yup
20:08 < IanJackson> Hydroxide: I think we can call it approved by acclamation.
20:08 < IanJackson> Unless anyone disagrees.
20:08 < schultmc> I don't disagree
20:08 < IanJackson> Anything needs saying from or about the Secretary ?
20:08 < Hydroxide> jberkus: that's all I have. the actual income was before my time as treasurer, and I never saw the records. either Branden knows or it was before his time too.
20:09 < schultmc> Hydroxide: offline, please
20:09 < Maulkin> Nothing from me, just what's in teh agenda
20:09 < schultmc> [item 6, Spanish trademark report] 
20:09 < IanJackson> Maulkin: Right.  That's fine, thanks, carry on :-).
20:09 < schultmc> Maulkin: anything to report here?
20:09 < IanJackson> No report.  :-/
20:09 < Hydroxide> Maulkin: when can we get a report by?
20:10 < Maulkin> Right, I got a mail from Javier (the Debian guy) saying that Javier (The lawyer) may be rather disincentivised (Is that a word) in working for this
20:10 < Maulkin> I've offered to fly over and try and get the board rolling. I've heared nothing back so far.
20:10 < IanJackson> Hnnggg.
20:10 < IanJackson> I will be in Spain in May.  Where is all this ?
20:10 < Maulkin> IanJackson: Madrid
20:10 < IanJackson> I could probably manage a spare hour in Madrid.
20:11 < IanJackson> But it would have to be the right hour; my trains are already booked.
20:11 < Maulkin> IanJackson: That'll be cool :)
20:11  * Maulkin nods
20:11 < IanJackson> Maulkin: OK, I'll send you details.
20:11 < Maulkin> I hope to get more out of Javier / Javier asap.
20:11 < IanJackson> Will you mail the board list well before the next meeting ?
20:11 < Maulkin> (done)
20:12 < Maulkin> IanJackson: If I hear anything, sure :)
20:12 < IanJackson> Right, thanks.
20:12 < schultmc> [item 7, outstanding minutes]
20:12 < schultmc> Maulkin: you again
20:12 < Maulkin> One set of minutes: February 16th, 2007
20:12  * schultmc moves we vote to accept the minutes
20:12  * cdlu seconds
20:12 < IanJackson> I'm ready to vote.
20:13 < Maulkin> Voting started, 6 people (hydroxide,jberkus,schultmc,ianjackson,maulkin,cdlu) allowed to vote on Approve February 16th, 2007 minutes. - You may vote yes/no/abstain only, type !vote $yourchoice now.
20:13 < IanJackson> !vote yes
20:13 < Maulkin> !vote yes
20:13 < schultmc> !vote yes
20:13 < Hydroxide> !vote yes
20:13 < jberkus> !vote yes
20:13 < Maulkin> cdlu ?
20:13 < cdlu> !vote yes
20:13 < cdlu> sorry
20:13 < Maulkin> Current voting results for "Approve February 16th, 2007 minutes": Yes: 6, No: 0, Abstain: 0, Missing: 0 ()
20:13 < Maulkin> Voting for "Approve February 16th, 2007 minutes" closed.
20:13 < Maulkin> Done
20:14 < schultmc> [item 8, items up for discussion]
20:14 < schultmc> 8.1. 2007-02-15.jrk.1 - Openness of SPI Decision making
20:14 < schultmc> Hydroxide: you have the floor
20:14 < IanJackson> So I think 2007-02-15.jrk.1 is uncontroversial, surely ?
20:14 < IanJackson> We still need to talk about my forumshifting question but let's deal with that by email.
20:15 < cdlu> it seems like overlegislation to me.
20:15 < IanJackson> I'll write it up as a resolution for next meeting.
20:15 < jberkus> good by me
20:15 < IanJackson> cdlu: We have failed to do it.
20:15 < IanJackson> Writing it down will help I think.
20:15 < cdlu> Ian, I'm sure we'll do it magically by virtue of the legislation :)
20:15 < Hydroxide> cdlu: as Ian said, we haven't actually been abiding by that level of openness
20:15 < IanJackson> cdlu: I think it might help and it doesn't hurt.
20:16 < Maulkin> Right... are we voting on what I've got on the agenda, or has it changed?
20:16  * Maulkin is preparing vote lines :)
20:16  * Hydroxide is ready to vote unless people have questions or discussion
20:17  * Maulkin moves so
20:17  * Hydroxide seconds
20:17 < Maulkin> Voting started, 6 people (hydroxide,jberkus,schultmc,ianjackson,maulkin,cdlu) allowed to vote on Approve Resolution 2007-02-15.jrk.1 - Openness of SPI Decision making. - You may vote yes/no/abstain only, type !vote $yourchoice now.
20:17 < IanJackson> !vote yes
20:17 < Hydroxide> !vote yes
20:17 < jberkus> !vote yes
20:17 < schultmc> !vote yes
20:17 < cdlu> !vote abstain
20:17 < Maulkin> !vote abstain
20:17 < Maulkin> Current voting results for "Approve Resolution 2007-02-15.jrk.1 - Openness of SPI Decision making": Yes: 4, No: 0, Abstain: 2, Missing: 0 ()
20:17 < Maulkin> Voting for "Approve Resolution 2007-02-15.jrk.1 - Openness of SPI Decision making" closed.
20:17 < Maulkin> Done
20:17 < schultmc> 8.2. 2007-02-28.iwj.1.jrk.1 - Formally recording Debian's status as an Associated Project
20:17 < schultmc> IanJackson, Hydroxide: you have the floor
20:17 < Maulkin> Right, can someone tell me what is going on with this?
20:18 < IanJackson> http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~ijackson/t.txt
20:18 < Hydroxide> IanJackson: can you answer? I need to switch vts for a sec
20:18 < IanJackson> c&p from my email
20:18 < IanJackson> We've all seen the discussion.
20:18  * Maulkin hasn't
20:18 < IanJackson> Oh.
20:18 < cdlu> naturally it all happened in the last 30 minutes before meeting
20:18 < Maulkin> That's why I'm annoyed
20:18 < cdlu> so I haven't either
20:19 < Maulkin> Can someone summarise the main differences?
20:19 < IanJackson> Well, as you know there is a bit of an argument about whether we're supposed to have nominated contacts and only decisions passed by them count, or whether we're supposed to look at and follow the Debian constitution.
20:19 < Hydroxide> most of it actually hasn't changed from ian's mail
20:19 < Maulkin> IanJackson: yup :)
20:19  * cdlu still doesn't understand why Debian's resolution needs to be so much more complicated than our cookie cutter version :)
20:20 < IanJackson> The paragraph about DDs telling us about disputes has been lengthened and tightened to try to assuage fears of us getting DoSsed by angry DDs.
20:20 < IanJackson> cdlu: Well, there seems to have been some dispute about some aspects and we get pushback.
20:20 < Maulkin> Okies, cool (p5?)
20:20 < IanJackson> And every time you get into an argument the resolution gets longer.
20:20 < IanJackson> Maulkin: Yes.
20:20 < cdlu> Ian, yes, a couple of people pushback over everything we do. It's no reason to write an essay for a resolution. 
20:20 < cdlu> that said, this one will do the trick. it's just silly.
20:21 < IanJackson> The other is that Debian is bigger than most of our other projects and has correspondingly more complex governance.
20:21 < jberkus> from my perspective, the resolution is unnecessarily long and complex
20:21 < Hydroxide> for those who don't know, Debian has over 1000 developers
20:21 < jberkus> but I don't have any issues of substance with it
20:21 < linuxpoet> I only have one suggestion, that somehow the resolution reflect the last email I was sent from IAN where we get an official response from a series of DDs that provides the reference documentation to the decision
20:21 -!- slef [~mjr@g.towers.org.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20:21 < IanJackson> Hydroxide: That weird formatting in para 6 is a mistake, right ?
20:21 < Hydroxide> IanJackson: yeah, I mean for uniform formatting
20:21 < IanJackson> Hydroxide: OK, well I'm sure Maulkin will fix it up for us, won't you ? :-)
20:22 < IanJackson> There is no hurry here.
20:22 < IanJackson> If people want to catch up and read the threads and argue some more we can defer it.
20:22 < Hydroxide> Maulkin: the changes to paragraphs 3 and 4 are only the addition of everything after the last comma
20:22  * Maulkin will fix formatting
20:22 < IanJackson> So feel free to vote `no' meaning `please explain more'.
20:22 < Hydroxide> Maulkin: and I didn't change anything outside of paragraphs 3-5
20:23 < Hydroxide> Maulkin: so it's really not that many changes to happen last-minute
20:23 < Maulkin> Right, fine for me, I'm happy to vote
20:23 < Hydroxide> Maulkin: it's basically one long paragraph plus a couple of clauses
20:23 < Maulkin> (thanks fo rthe summary :P)
20:23 < IanJackson> These changes are ones to try to satisfy the difficulties that some people expressed earlier this week.
20:23 -!- slef [~mjr@g.towers.org.uk] has joined #spi
20:23 < Hydroxide> np
20:23 < Hydroxide> any more discussion or should we vote?
20:23 < IanJackson> linuxpoet: I think in practice we could just ask me for references :-).
20:24 < Hydroxide> linuxpoet: (what he means is he wrote the first draft of the debian constitution and was a DPL back in the day)
20:24  * Hydroxide moves to vote
20:24  * schultmc seconds
20:24 < IanJackson> Yes, I'm ready to vote.
20:24 < Maulkin> Voting started, 6 people (hydroxide,jberkus,schultmc,ianjackson,maulkin,cdlu) allowed to vote on Approve Resolution 2007-02-28.iwj.1 - Formally recording Debian's status as an Associated Project. - You may vote yes/no/abstain only, type !vote $yourchoice now.
20:24 < Maulkin> (plus amednment)
20:24 < IanJackson> The text we are voting on is   http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~ijackson/t.txt   FAOD
20:24 < IanJackson> !vote yes
20:24 < schultmc> !vote yes
20:25 < Hydroxide> !vote yes
20:25 < Maulkin> !vote yes
20:25 < cdlu> !vote abstain
20:25 < IanJackson> Err, that's not a stable URL.  I've copied it here http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~ijackson/2007-02-28.iwj.1.txt
20:25 < Maulkin> Ta IanJackson 
20:25 < IanJackson> cd7fd66e7730ae813dd6caeb2cd997a4  2007-02-28.iwj.1.txt
20:25 < jberkus> !vote abstain
20:26 < Maulkin> Current voting results for "Approve Resolution 2007-02-28.iwj.1 - Formally recording Debian's status as an Associated Project": Yes: 4, No: 0, Abstain: 2, Missing: 0 ()
20:26 < Maulkin> Voting for "Approve Resolution 2007-02-28.iwj.1 - Formally recording Debian's status as an Associated Project" closed.
20:26 < Hydroxide> well, as per the previous resolution we passed, our resolutions and minutes approved at this meeting will need to be emailed out to spi-announce anyway
20:26 < IanJackson> Right, thanks everyone.
20:26 < Hydroxide> (as wichert akkerman did when he was secretary, fwiw, at least for resolutions)
20:26 < Maulkin> FWIW: 'yay', as I now need to reconvert everything back to plain text
20:26 < Hydroxide> ok, josh's resolution now
20:26 < schultmc> 8.3. 2007-03-16.jmb.1 - Accepting OpenOffice.org as Associated Project
20:26 < schultmc> jberkus: you have the floor
20:27  * Maulkin is happy to just vote :)
20:27 < Hydroxide> Maulkin: lynx -dump or one of the many other similar commands will be fine
20:27 < jberkus> well, I don't think that there's anyone here who doesn't know OpenOffice.org
20:27 < Maulkin> kk
20:27 < Maulkin> Do we have someone here? :)
20:27 < jberkus> so I'll turn it over to Louis to make a couple remarks about why OOo wants to join SPI
20:27 < schultmc> louis_to is from OOo
20:27 < jberkus> Louis?
20:27 < IanJackson> Maulkin: Actually, can I suggest that you put the resolutions up in <pre> in the original formatting ?
20:27 < Maulkin> IanJackson: fine :)
20:28 < jberkus> louis_to: ping!
20:28 < cdlu> that's how I did it. <pre>++ :)
20:28 < Maulkin> IanJackson: Well, I'll work out exactly what to do later :)
20:28  * cdlu likes the OOo resolution. it's simple, doesn't waste bits. :)
20:28 < Maulkin> heh
20:28  * Hydroxide thinks it's fine and therefore optimal in the case of OOo as well.
20:28 < louis_to> hello all
20:28  * Maulkin waves
20:28 < IanJackson> The resolution seems to agree with OOo's own statement about the advisor position so I'm fine with it.
20:29 < IanJackson> I'm happy to vote.
20:29 < Maulkin> louis_to: Any comments?
20:29 < louis_to> nope; thanks
20:29  * cdlu moves for a vote
20:29  * schultmc seconds
20:29  * Maulkin 2nds
20:29 < Maulkin> Voting started, 6 people (hydroxide,jberkus,schultmc,ianjackson,maulkin,cdlu) allowed to vote on Approve Resolution 2007-03-16.jmb.1 - Accepting OpenOffice.org as Associated Project. - You may vote yes/no/abstain only, type !vote $yourchoice now.
20:29 < Maulkin> !vote yes
20:29 < cdlu> !vote yes
20:29 < IanJackson> !vote yes
20:29 < schultmc> !vote yes
20:29 < Hydroxide> !vote yes
20:29 < jberkus> !vote yes
20:29 < cdlu> now *that* was uncontroversial. :)
20:29 < Maulkin> Current voting results for "Approve Resolution 2007-03-16.jmb.1 - Accepting OpenOffice.org as Associated Project": Yes: 6, No: 0, Abstain: 0, Missing: 0 ()
20:29 < Maulkin> Voting for "Approve Resolution 2007-03-16.jmb.1 - Accepting OpenOffice.org as Associated Project" closed.
20:29 < Maulkin> Done
20:30 < louis_to> thanks all :-)
20:30 < schultmc> [item 9, Next board meeting]
20:30 < Hydroxide> louis_to: if you want, you can accept the invitation now
20:30 < Maulkin> louis_to: please hang aroung :)
20:30 < Hydroxide> louis_to: just to avoid worrying about the 60-day period
20:30 < louis_to> thanks: i shall, though I have to leae shortly
20:30 < cdlu> April 20th... my wife's birthday :)
20:30 < louis_to> ah; 
20:30 < schultmc> The third Friday in April is April 20, 2007.  At the last meeting, we decided to move the meeting back to 19:00 UTC
20:30 < schultmc> any objections?
20:30 < Maulkin> louis_to: ok, please /msg me your email address
20:30 -!- slef [~mjr@g.towers.org.uk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20:30 < louis_to> I accept the invitation and thank the board members
20:30 < cdlu> April 20th is fine
20:30 < Hydroxide> louis_to: welcome :)
20:30  * Maulkin nods at April 20th. I wasn't sure on the time :)
20:31 < IanJackson> I'm currently fine with that.
20:31 < Hydroxide> one sec...
20:31  * schultmc is fine with that
20:31 < IanJackson> 2000Z would be a problem for me, given the DST change.
20:31 < Hydroxide> yes, that's fine
20:31 < jberkus> I'll be attending a conference, so there is a 50% chance I won't make it
20:31 < cdlu> louis, cool. Just curious, do you live in my neck of the woods? I see you're on rogers. :)
20:31 < IanJackson> Err, I mean, the fact we have DST.
20:31 -!- slef [~mjr@g.towers.org.uk] has joined #spi
20:31 < Hydroxide> (1900Z I mean)
20:31 < jberkus> however, nothing in the same week would be any better
20:31 < IanJackson> 1900Z is the same civil time for most of us as last year.
20:31 < jberkus> so don't change it
20:31 < IanJackson> Anyone object to 1900Z ?
20:31 < cdlu> not here
20:31 < Maulkin> Not here
20:31 < Hydroxide> not here
20:32 < schultmc> not here
20:32 < schultmc> The next meeting is scheduled for Friday, April 20, 2007 at 19:00 UTC
20:32 < Maulkin> That'll do then.
20:32 < schultmc> *GAVEL*